September 11th, 2009: Eight long years do little to heal the scars

[bujhee kom]

Absolutely dear Dr. Z bhai. The day was a very dark, cold and rainy one here! It was very important and good to remember and good to unite and let go of the self-egos, even for a day! Alhamdulillah! Loving all of Allah's creation is loving Allah and respecting him as these are all his properties!

Thank you dear nz bro!

[Electrequiem]

BK Bhai, thank you for that wonderful post. We had a candlelight vigil on campus earlier tonight ... and then a moment of silence to remember those who have left us behind on that day. The rain was a nuisance here, too, but not too many cared. We felt a sense of oneness as people from all walks of life held hands in prayers. The vigil ended with a heart-warming rendition of the US national anthem on violin. There we stood in silence, with the heavens above and the ground below ... praying for everything in between to be in peace.

[BanCricFan]

Originally Posted by bujhee kom
Just finished my Tarabi and right after that I ran Uptown Manhattan at the Ring Garden on Riverside Drive (near my home) and joined a group of good people, some Lutherans/Episcapilians/Catholics, Buddhists (I didn't know these guys, some were far easterners) and some of Jewish faith (3 Israelies) and a few of us Shiites (bunch of Syrians , Palestinians, Pershians) and Sunnis (me and a few other) and a whole bunch of self-claimed athiests (good folks) had a good soul searching, bonding, prayer, candle light, thoughts share amongst us! For the 6th year in a row we promissed how we will look out for each other, support each other and love each other and will never forget to pray (the ones among us who pray) for the murdered innocent victims (World Trade Center, New York, Pentagon, Pennsylvania, Scotland Lockerby, Bali, London, Oklahoma City, Tel Aviv, Tibet, Auschwitz, Jerrusalem, Sarejevo, Tehran, Baghdad to Basra) of terrorism (state sponsored or induvidual action,) and war (funded, controlled by the West or the East).

We have been doing this for 6 years and for the last 3 years in a row they have asked me to lead the prayers, Alhamdulillah! I lost 2 distant relatives of mine, a husband and a wife, in the September 11 terrorist attck at the World Trade Center, I see their orphans (I became close to them kids over the years), they were there with me along with 15-16 other Albenian/Bosnian orphans beautiful young souls!

We won't get those perished lost souls back just I will never see or hear the laughter of the murdered Officers/Soldiers at the Pilkhana massacre (I mentioned them in our prayer as well), but we can take initiative and remember them and let all the passers-by know who we are softly speaking of, remembering and the beautiful thing was a lot of them joined us slowly and it grew quiet large at the end (close to 70, including some NYPD cops from the 34th precinct) and we all hugged each other very strongly (I like that)

It was a cold rainy night here tonight but I sweated as I had the spirits landed on me and I swear my friends I felt it, top to bottom! It was a sad day/night for many many of us, but it was a beautiful thing, Alhamdulillah!

By the way we also had a mother with us who's child/ a firefighter (Engine/Ladder 28, Inwwod, Manhattan) also died that day eight years ago! She is a friend of mine now, and It's her who always requests me to lead the prayer.

May Allah forgive the victims of war and terrorism and give them eternal peace!

Rest in peace dear all. You will never be forgotten!


P.S. Thank you dear Eleqtrequiem bhai for openning this thread, a very good thread indeed! May Allah
's love and blessing be with you always, good initiative!

Great post, BB!

[Banglatiger84]

Originally Posted by nzfan
It is comments like that , which really put the western soldiers on the back foot

Its ok for the terrorist to kill civilians and use them as shields but as soon as one civilian dies from an american bomb accidently, then its hell to pay

They don't do it on purpose

And to say that they kill them to get revenge for the killing of their own is wrong. In this you are implying that the terrorists are "one of you" are the muslims who died in the 9/11 bombings somehow classed differently?

Ahh, another gross generalization...

I did not say the terrorists are justified . In fact more Iraqis have been killed by other iraqis than by Americans.

But whitewashing thousands of civilian deaths in Iraq simply because we "should never forget 9-11".

As if one terrorist attack conducted by AQ is justification to pass on thousands of Iraq deaths as "collateral damage".

For the record, I dont really differentiate between Muslim and non-Muslim deaths.

9-11 is bad because 3000+ innocent civilians died. Similarly the siege of Fallujah was wrong because hundreds of innocent civilians died including 12 year old boys who were prevented from fleeing the city by American soldiers.

[BanCricFan]

Originally Posted by Banglatiger84
...

I did not say the terrorists are justified . In fact more Iraqis have been killed by other iraqis than by Americans.

Can you substantiate this other than citing the Zionist owned media like Fox, CNN or other similar outlets?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pqS4V...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3y_5v...1&feature=fvwp

[Beamer]

Moving stuff B_K bhai. If I can be 1/10th of a man that you are one day , I will consider myself blessed.

[Ajfar]

BK bhai you are awesome.

[Ajfar]

Originally Posted by Banglatiger84
What do you have to be grateful to American soldiers for? For killing Iraqis and Afghans so that they cant attack you?

People join the force because they love their country and want to serve it. and i respect them for that. i think that's what electrequem bhai was trying to say.

[Banglatiger84]

Originally Posted by bangladesh_sy
People join the force because they love their country and want to serve it. and i respect them for that. i think that's what electrequem bhai was trying to say.

I dont know about other countries, but there must be a reason why the American military population (at least among combat troops) is in general skewed towards people from poorer and less educated backgrounds. Surely it cant be that they actually love the US more than others?

[al Furqaan]

Originally Posted by nzfan

Its ok for the terrorist to kill civilians and use them as shields but as soon as one civilian dies from an american bomb accidently, then its hell to pay

They don't do it on purpose

i don't anyone is condoning the killing of civilians explicitly...we are those dead civilians! rather, there is an absence of condemnation by muslims as a whole, generally because their efforts are focused more on defending their image as well as voicing opposition to the wars in iraq, afghanistan, pakistan, etc.

some of the more outrageous incidents were indeed done on purpose, such as the rape of Abir al Janabi, a 14 year old Iraqi girl, who was then shot along with her parents and younger sister, survived by two younger brothers. but the usually daily, deaths of 20 villagers in pakistan, or 45 wedding guests in afghanistan, or 15 school children in gaza or tikrit usally only get condemned on cricket forums, with little mention from CAIR or ISNA or even the OIC.

what is ultimately the most troubling issue, is that the majority of muslims world-wide and many westerners don't think of each other as complete human beings. in other words, mistakes are forgiveable only if commited by oneself, and the other side should be the one willing to bend over backwards in order to reach any agreement.

in then end, i think that we are all to blame, or no one is to blame for what is going on.

[Banglatiger84]

Originally Posted by al Furqaan

some of the more outrageous incidents were indeed done on purpose, such as the rape of Abir al Janabi, a 14 year old Iraqi girl, who was then shot along with her parents and younger sister, survived by two younger brothers. but the usually daily, deaths of 20 villagers in pakistan, or 45 wedding guests in afghanistan, .

And some people justify such events by saying "I'd rather a few dozen Pakistanis die than risk another 9/11"

[Electrequiem]

Originally Posted by Banglatiger84
I dont know about other countries, but there must be a reason why the American military population is in general skewed towards people from poorer and less educated backgrounds. Surely it cant be that they actually love the US more than others?

That's a really outrageous thing to say without proper citations.

[Zunaid]

Originally Posted by Banglatiger84
I dont know about other countries, but there must be a reason why the American military population is in general skewed towards people from poorer and less educated backgrounds. Surely it cant be that they actually love the US more than others?

Originally Posted by Electrequiem
That's a really outrageous thing to say without proper citations.

Which part is outrageous?

I don't have citations to back me up, but in almost every country without mandatory draft, the fodder for the military mill comes from the poorer sections of the society. Look to Bangladesh's own military makeup - the rank and file do not come from the middle/upper class.

[bujhee kom]

Originally Posted by Zunaid
BK - you have a fan in me.
Thank you.

Thank you my dearest Dr. Z bhaiya. It's the opposite, I am the biggest fan of the great Dr.!

Originally Posted by nzfan
best post BK has ever made

Thank you my dearest nzfan bhaiya (brother). Your good spirit always touches me deep bro! I mean it.

Originally Posted by Electrequiem
BK Bhai, thank you for that wonderful post. We had a candlelight vigil on campus earlier tonight ... and then a moment of silence to remember those who have left us behind on that day.... praying for everything in between to be in peace.

Thank you my dearest Electrequiem bhaiya. You are doing great things bhaiya! You shall reach nirvana and you shall reach it through pain and suffering, but at the end, during the final nightfall you shall have the eternal smile and peace!

Originally Posted by BanCricFan
Great post, BB!

Thank you my dearest skater BanCricFan bhaiya. Wait till I come to London, we have to skate around together and talk. I will bring my 'Jimmie Hendrix' with me!

Originally Posted by Beamer
Moving stuff B_K bhai. If I can be 1/10th of a man that you are one day , I will consider myself blessed.

Thank you my dearest Beamer bhaiya. That was way too humble, gracious, generous and kindly of you! Biriyani is on me when you are in NYC (@ Chittayinga 'Curry In A Hurry' on Lex)

Originally Posted by bangladesh_sy
BK bhai you are awesome.

Thank you my dearest Sy-baba bhaiya. It's your true and genuine awesomeness just reflects of me, I mean it bro!

[Ashraf-FTP]

that was far by one of the most touching posts in BC i hv read (competing with other Bk ones), i agree with beamer bhai, if i can ever be 1/10 of the person u are, i think i will be the luckiest person on earth.. i cant say anything else cause that will bring the greatness of ur post down

[al Furqaan]

Originally Posted by Banglatiger84
And some people justify such events by saying "I'd rather a few dozen Pakistanis die than risk another 9/11"

when push comes to shove, i'd bet that you and i would also rather have innocent people killed than our own families. i know i would.

difference is, when push does not come to shove, i will assert that innocent people should not be harmed even if means risking my own familiy's well being.

so those of whom u speak could be classified as "theoretical racists/bigots/self-supremacists" even though in practice we'd all act the same way.

interesting food for thought.

[chol_bd123]

I dont understand where these damn terrorists get their beliefs from.
My dad told me a hadith from the Sahih al Bukari that during a battle one of the Prophet Mohammed's (PBUH) companions was injured badly in a battle so he drove his blade through him to end the suffering. When the other warriors mourned for him saying that he was a brave warrior and he was alos an excellant Muslim. Our prophet said that this individual was going to go to hell for dieing in such a way.

And i am pretty sure about this because my dad told me this and he read it from Bukhari Sharib

[imtiaz82]

Originally Posted by chol_bd123
I dont understand where these damn terrorists get their beliefs from.
My dad told me a hadith from the Sahih al Bukari that during a battle one of the Prophet Mohammed's (PBUH) companions was injured badly in a battle so he drove his blade through him to end the suffering. When the other warriors mourned for him saying that he was a brave warrior and he was alos an excellant Muslim. Our prophet said that this individual was going to go to hell for dieing in such a way.

And i am pretty sure about this because my dad told me this and he read it from Bukhari Sharib

Well that is because this ideology has nothing to do with Islam(Quran or Hadaith). Infact someone can take verses from any religous texts be it Bible or Towrah to cause violence and bloodshed if they want to.

This hate and rise of terrorism is a result of of various geo-political situations in the middle east over the last century. More recently it can be tied to the Soviet Invasion of Afghanistan, the war and the civil war after end of occupation completely broke down the civil society. Infact till 1970s Afghanistan was a relatively moderate country just like most developing countries. But the influx of foreign weapons, meltdown of infrastructure, industries, educational and legal sytem, eventually created the breeding ground for such organizations. Youths were without jobs and aim in life(due to death of close family members and lack of jobs). In this circumstance, you can use literally any scripture or ideology, be it Christianity, Taoism or Communism to create a group of terrorists to serve your own purpose. Since the region happen to be muslim majority, the main ideology to be used as a tool for brainwashing was ofcourse Islamic scriptures.

If you leave Afghanistan aside and pick any other countries like Iraq or Iran. The reason for the conflicts, anti-west views e.tc. are all tied to political or economic reasons rather than religious.Many ME countries have puppet governments/dictators put in place for uninterrupted supply of gas/oil, creating rift in the general population and encouraging seperatist or other suicidal movements.

Infact my personal opinion is, the long term solution to this world terrorism crisis is to develop countries like Afghanistan,Iraq(economically) and integrate them to greater world society. The same thing that was done with Germany and Japan after second world war.

This was a lesson learned from first world war. The various treaties forced on Germany by UK and US after WWI, forced to create a monster symbolized by the rise of Hitler and Nazism. Since countries like Afghanistan, Iraq or Iran are not technologically advanced as Germany, their reaction/outburst to similar events has been through terrorism and small scale conflicts(instead of a full scale war which they cannot afford). So just by bombing talibans and vowing to wipe out extremists won't help, since more such organizations will pop-up.You have to remove the root cause that is brewing these kind of ideologies.. develop the region and empower the people!

[al Furqaan]

nice thoughts imtiaz bhai, i agree mostly.

but i'd wager that most educated afghans left the country long ago. unlike iraq, which was a pretty modern society during the Saddam era and even today. given that, afghanistan was mostly a tribalized society and whatever infrastructure they had was destroyed by the Soviet invasion. in addition, US empowered the mujahideen to combat the soviets, and once the USSR withdrew (and later collapsed) the only group with any power remaining where the foreign and (mostly local) taliban. this is why it was reasonably easy for them to take over 95% of the country.

the situation in iraq is quite different. majority of the terrorists there are foreigners drawn there by AQ due to the massive US presence. iraq was and still is one of the more moderate and modern arab and muslim states out there. the war has created utter turmoil and also a lot of sectarian in-fighting which wasn't necessarily there before.

at the end of the day, in all cases, extremism of all stripes is born out of some inner psychological crisis...it fulfills a need to change ones identity or at least give the illusion of choosing one's destiny. very very very few people from stable or relatively happy childhoods change religions or abandon religions. there is always a pyschological trigger.

[Imteaz]

May Allah bless all the departed soul.

[imtiaz82]

Originally Posted by al Furqaan
nice thoughts imtiaz bhai, i agree mostly.

the situation in iraq is quite different. majority of the terrorists there are foreigners drawn there by AQ due to the massive US presence. iraq was and still is one of the more moderate and modern arab and muslim states out there. the war has created utter turmoil and also a lot of sectarian in-fighting which wasn't necessarily there before.

I agree, that's why I mentioned in the third paragraph that the issue in Iraq is mostly related to conflict rising from natural resources i.e oil. If Iraq did not have the second largest oil reserve in the world, US would have never gone there regardless of who the dictator was. 9-11 was carried out by terrorists/Al-Qaeda who at that point were mostly centered around ideologies coming from Afghanistan,most possibly Saudi Arabia as well since the monarchy and their ties with western powers have pushed some of their people to extremist lines also.

Anyways,may the victims of the terrorist activities rest in peace.In the end there is no justification for brutalities and crime against humanity, whether it is caused by Americans, Afghanis, Saudis or Bangladeshis. I would go for candle light vigil and interfaith mourning ceremonies for the victims of 9-11, 7-7 in UK, the thousands of civilians killed in Afghanistan and Iraq as a result of mindless aerial bombing to the children massacared by Israeli forces in Lebanon and Palestine. They are all victims of agression in one way or other..

[Electrequiem]

In remembrance of the tragic loss of lives nine years ago.

Renewed call for the preservation of the values that make America what it is.

[Zunaid]

Thumbs up Electrequiem ...

God bless America.

[Ajfar]

My prayer goes out to all the families that lost their loved one. I want to thank BK bhai again for that one heck of a post. Its still very inspiring

Posted via BC Mobile Edition (iPhone)

Originally Posted by bujhee kom
Just finished my Tarabi and right after that I ran Uptown Manhattan at the Ring Garden on Riverside Drive (near my home) and joined a group of good people, some Lutherans/Episcapilians/Catholics, Buddhists (I didn't know these guys, some were far easterners) and some of Jewish faith (3 Israelies) and a few of us Shiites (bunch of Syrians , Palestinians, Pershians) and Sunnis (me and a few other) and a whole bunch of self-claimed athiests (good folks) had a good soul searching, bonding, prayer, candle light, thoughts share amongst us! For the 6th year in a row we promissed how we will look out for each other, support each other and love each other and will never forget to pray (the ones among us who pray) for the murdered innocent victims (World Trade Center, New York, Pentagon, Pennsylvania, Scotland Lockerby, Bali, London, Oklahoma City, Tel Aviv, Tibet, Auschwitz, Jerrusalem, Sarejevo, Tehran, Baghdad to Basra) of terrorism (state sponsored or induvidual action,) and war (funded, controlled by the West or the East).

We have been doing this for 6 years and for the last 3 years in a row they have asked me to lead the prayers, Alhamdulillah! I lost 2 distant relatives of mine, a husband and a wife, in the September 11 terrorist attck at the World Trade Center, I see their orphans (I became close to them kids over the years), they were there with me along with 15-16 other Albenian/Bosnian orphans beautiful young souls!

We won't get those perished lost souls back just I will never see or hear the laughter of the murdered Officers/Soldiers at the Pilkhana massacre (I mentioned them in our prayer as well), but we can take initiative and remember them and let all the passers-by know who we are softly speaking of, remembering and the beautiful thing was a lot of them joined us slowly and it grew quiet large at the end (close to 70, including some NYPD cops from the 34th precinct) and we all hugged each other very strongly (I like that)

It was a cold rainy night here tonight but I sweated as I had the spirits landed on me and I swear my friends I felt it, top to bottom! It was a sad day/night for many many of us, but it was a beautiful thing, Alhamdulillah!

By the way we also had a mother with us who's child/ a firefighter (Engine/Ladder 28, Inwwod, Manhattan) also died that day eight years ago! She is a friend of mine now, and It's her who always requests me to lead the prayer.

May Allah forgive the victims of war and terrorism and give them eternal peace!

Rest in peace dear all. You will never be forgotten!


P.S. Thank you dear Eleqtrequiem bhai for openning this thread, a very good thread indeed! May Allah
's love and blessing be with you always, good initiative!

[bujhee kom]

Ohh thank you my dearest Sy baba bhaiya!!!

Always heart-felt prayers for the 3000+ innocent murdered victims!